While hordes of Jair Bolsonaro supporters carried out an assault on their government on Sunday in an eerily similar fashion to Jan. 6, the former Brazilian president was in Florida.
But he’s not there on vacation to decompress from, or protest, his election loss to the country’s new president, Luiz Inácio Lula de Silva, according Ruth Ben-Ghiat, author of Strongmen: Mussolini to the Present.
She joined this episode of The New Abnormal podcast alongside co-host Danielle Moodie to talk about the Brazilian insurrection, what makes people choose fascism instead of a healthy democracy, and why she is sure Bolsonaro’s trip to the States is nothing but a ploy to avoid legal consequences.
“The reason Bolsonaro is in Florida, it’s not that he’s sulking there, it’s that he’s under investigation for various potential crimes,” says Ben-Ghiat. And, she adds, “Two of his sons actually were caught trying to enter the Italian embassy in Brasília to try and get Italian citizenship. They don’t wanna stick around.”
This lines up, given that Ben-Ghiat also has receipts that show Bolsonaro and former President Donald Trump are more sneaky and manipulative than some give them credit for, including “using their bodies very seductively” to trick the media.
Plus! Co-host Andy Levy chats with journalist Jeb Lund, who tells him all about his alma mater the New College of Florida, and all the ways Governor Ron DeSantis is trying to “destroy” it.